Author Topic: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.  (Read 19121 times)

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spacecase0

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #15 on: February 13, 2015, 11:22:56 PM »
the biggest place that made them stopped making them (lakeview),
I have 2 brands of them, so I know that others made them at some point

here is a new one listed
http://www.tentec.com/products/40-Meter-Hamstick-Mobile-Style-Antenna.html

but my guess is that it is made by MFJ
http://www.mfjenterprises.com/Product.php?productid=MFJ-1640T

I think the name hamstick might still be owned by the company that no longer makes them
so try not to use it when searching for them,

ghrit

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #16 on: February 13, 2015, 11:54:15 PM »
but my guess is that it is made by MFJ
http://www.mfjenterprises.com/Product.php?productid=MFJ-1640T

That 1640T looks a lot like a "Firestik" antenna I had back in the CB days.
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DragoSapien

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #17 on: February 14, 2015, 01:09:05 PM »
Nether has an 80m stick. Can the 75m be used in its place?

DragoSapien

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #18 on: February 14, 2015, 01:15:21 PM »
« Last Edit: February 14, 2015, 01:32:53 PM by DragoSapien »

Tevin

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #19 on: February 14, 2015, 06:18:20 PM »
Found these too. 

http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/hamantm/2083.html

I like this stand to mount them on.
http://www.mfjenterprises.com/Product.php?productid=MFJ-1919EX

My understanding is that "Ham sticks" are not any particular product, although the proper noun may be floating around out there somewhere. They are just garden variety mobile antennas that thread into the MFJ clamp (at least that's how I'm set up). The items in the Universal Radio link will work fine. Keep in mind you will need two of them for each band as you are really just making a dipole. I think I paid $18 each for mine at a hamfest so Universal's price is not too bad compared to that.

The MFJ tripod is really nice. I wish I knew about that before I bought the thing I'm using now. Again, we are talking tradeoffs. Once you go to a hamstick/MFJ tripod arrangement you give up the portability and ease of deployment of a Buddipole.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2015, 07:29:56 PM by Tevin »

spacecase0

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2015, 12:17:50 AM »
Nether has an 80m stick. Can the 75m be used in its place?
I know that I am bad at math, but 75M = 80M
it is the same band,
one is on the CW side of it and the other is the voice side of it
at least mine tunes across the entire band by moving the height of the whip

DragoSapien

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2015, 12:46:01 PM »
I my still look at the Buddipole for rapid deployment, but Im thinking ill be putting the hamstick dipole's on my 40' home tower. Would three different dipole's affect each other on the same pole about a foot apart?

Also, how about the Buddistick. What performance difference is there in the two?

Tempstar

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #22 on: February 15, 2015, 08:32:49 PM »
At 40' they will rock!
The hamsticks are tunable, so you don't need a tuner. The buddipole uses coils to match and a tuner is a good idea to trim out the last bit.
Just always remember when deciding on an antenna: To make it shorter than a half wave dipole, something has to be sacrificed, usually it is the wattage of the radio being given up as heat, and usually in a matching network of coils. You always have to make the decision of what you can live without. I sacrifice 2/3 of my hundred watts with my Chameleon to get portability, and half my power with my end fed. The math never lies.
 Now for the good side: You can do a lot with just a few watts on HF if conditions are good. I worked a station in TN from SC with the 500 mw exciter output once, forgot to turn on the damn amp. Now I rarely go over 50 watts because I know my antenna system is putting out 90% of my power. The reason compromise antennas work is because the 10 watts you get out of them is enough a lot of the time.
 I routinely do work at a TV station that has a 400,000 watt ERP driven by 18,000 watts up the 2200' long, 6 !/8" hardline. With those gain numbers, a small percentage of loss at the bottom will make a huge loss at the top, and more importantly, a huge reduction in field strength which can relate to lost revenue because people just can't see a picture. The point is, without a system that is matched well with small losses, throwing watts at the problem does little to fix it.
Whew. Guess I was overdue on my antenna rant for February.
73
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Tevin

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #23 on: February 17, 2015, 05:52:05 PM »
The math never lies.

Tempstar is right...the math never lies.

In addition to his very good examples, it's important to know that losses due to SWR are not linear. For example: If you are losing 5 watts at 1.5:1 that does not mean you lose 10 watts at 3:1. It's actually much worse and it works against you all the more if you don't have that many watts to begin with.

The math goes like this:

At 1.3:1 you lose only 1.7% of your power. At 1.5:1 it goes to 4%. Everyone thinks a 1.5 SWR is pretty good, but if you can shave it down just 0.2 points it will cut your loss by more than half.

If the SWR is 2.0:1 your wattage loss jumps to 11.0%. The bottom line: An SWR increase of approximately 40% translates into nearly ten times the wattage loss. That's not including line loss and all the other built in inefficiency.

At 3.0:1, you are losing a full 25% of your power, over six times what you were losing at 1.5:1 or nearly fifteen times what you were giving up at 1.3:1.

So the moral of the story is to get your antenna as resonant as possible without a tuner. Even a few tenths of a point matters a lot. You don't want to be in a situation where you are throwing away 11% of your power right out of the box and calling it "good enough".

Here is the calculator I used to do my math. There are others out there that will do the same thing for coax cable losses:

http://www.csgnetwork.com/vswrlosscalc.html

 
« Last Edit: February 17, 2015, 05:54:10 PM by Tevin »

Tempstar

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #24 on: February 17, 2015, 08:31:27 PM »
Great one Tev. I still do the Log20 method. I have that site bookmarked in my "timesavers" folder now.
"Preparedness is a lot more than just buying stuff"

DragoSapien

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #25 on: February 23, 2015, 08:29:23 PM »
I have a question about grounding. Some friends in the club have mobile screwdriver antennas on there trucks and are always saying that its important to have good grounding to the frame. The Buddipole or ham sticks cant be grounded like this. How are they grounded. Also if I put the hamstick dipole on my 40' tower, What type of grounding am I suppose to do for that?

AD

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #26 on: February 23, 2015, 10:31:10 PM »
The only dumb question is the one that did not get asked!!

ghrit

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #27 on: February 23, 2015, 10:37:00 PM »
I have a question about grounding. Some friends in the club have mobile screwdriver antennas on there trucks and are always saying that its important to have good grounding to the frame. The Buddipole or ham sticks cant be grounded like this. How are they grounded. Also if I put the hamstick dipole on my 40' tower, What type of grounding am I suppose to do for that?
I'm assuming that your 40 ft tower is not a mobile --
If you are using a dipole such as a buddiepole or pair of hamsticks arranged similarly, there's no need for a ground plane.  Grounding the tower (lightning protection) and the radio (rf and power ground) will do the job.

Those screwdrivers and similar mobile antennas need a ground plane, which (in effect) acts as the other half of a dipole.  A completely different deal.
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Tempstar

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #28 on: August 24, 2015, 08:29:28 PM »
And another one from my bag of "wonder if this will work": three hamstick dipoles mounted on the same pole 1' apart (horizontally) will work as a fan dipole. Just add tees and short jumpers. I did 20,40, and 80. You will have to peak the tuning on each once they are mounted as they do affect each other a bit. I show 3 db loss which is 1 S-unit, and 1/2 of my power. But 50 watts will work the world, as will 5.
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Captain Crunch

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Re: I'm ready to get a Buddipole, I think.
« Reply #29 on: August 25, 2015, 06:27:11 PM »